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2001 Civic Low side service valve leaking..... Pages: 12

atxjax on Sat June 27, 2009 10:40 PM User is offlineView users profile

Year: 01
Make: Honda
Model: Civic
Engine Size: 1.7L
Refrigerant Type: R134a
Ambient Temp: 100
Pressure Low: 50
Pressure High: 140
Country of Origin: United States

Hi guys,


I got everything fixed and found the leak. I replaced the low side service valave but it still leaks out. I confirme dby filling the serice valve with water and watching bubbles come up. I adjusted it to where it almost stopped but I still have like 1 very tiny bubble about every 4 to 5 minutes. Should it be OK with the cover cap justscrewed it very tight?




(OLD info below)

Awesome forum. Thanks for all the great info here. I got a question specific to my my situation here.

So my cars A/C started getting weak, it would barely blow cool air at idle or on the highway. I went ahead and replaced the dryer and the expansion valve. On these civics its a pain in the butt.

I pulled a vaccum for about 2 hours and let it sit overnight. It held so I know I dont have any leaks in the system.

I recharged it with 18 ounces of refrigerant. The cars specs call between 17.6 to 19.2 ounces. I left it at 50PSI on the low side and the high side was reading about 140.

Initially when I first charged it I was getting 40 degree vent temps. Put my tools away ran some errands but noticed that later that day the cooling capability went down. It was barely blowing 60 degree air.

I took a water hose and ran it across the condensor and noticed the low side reading was dropping so I removed some of the R134 down to about 45 PSI. The high side is reading 120.

At idle or city driving the car doesnt feel like its cooling at all. Maybe 70 degree air. When I am on the highway the vent temps get down to about 46 degrees. What do you guys think can be wrong?

Edited: Wed July 01, 2009 at 2:09 PM by atxjax

daman on Sat June 27, 2009 11:43 PM User is offlineView users profile

sounds like your getting poor air flow over the condenser,is your fan working RIGHT? shields in place?

-------------------------
'00 Pontiac Sunfire 2200 I4 SFI
'99 Chevy 4x4 Z-71 5.7 Vortec v8 CPFI
'97 Chevy 4x4 6.5 Turbo Diesel 2500
'95 Pontiac Grand Am GT 3100 v6 SFI
'88 Chevrolet Camaro IROC 5.7 TPI(49,000 original miles)

atxjax on Sun June 28, 2009 12:00 AM User is offlineView users profile

Yes sir. Fans both kick on and the shields are there. I can feel the fans pull heat into the engine bay. Although I do notice that the compressor is on always when the a/c is on.

I am going to take the front clip of the car off and wash the condensor off. if that doesbt do it you guys tihnk I need a new condensor?

daman on Sun June 28, 2009 12:16 AM User is offlineView users profile

how does it look? all full of bugs fins bent?,, had a grand am once that the cond was so bad only a new used one help it.

-------------------------
'00 Pontiac Sunfire 2200 I4 SFI
'99 Chevy 4x4 Z-71 5.7 Vortec v8 CPFI
'97 Chevy 4x4 6.5 Turbo Diesel 2500
'95 Pontiac Grand Am GT 3100 v6 SFI
'88 Chevrolet Camaro IROC 5.7 TPI(49,000 original miles)

Chick on Sun June 28, 2009 7:48 AM User is offlineView users profile

A high side of just 140 at 100 degrees ambient doesn't look good. First, once you fill the factory amount into the system, you NEVER remove any to adjust the pressures, you have no idea how much you removed, and on such a small system it could be critical enough to damage your compressor.. Recover your charge, vacuum the system and recharge the factory amount. Then post your low and high side pressures here at 1500 rpm, and also feel the lines, especially the suction line from the evap to the compressor..should be cold.. Since you had the evap exposed, I'd also be looking for a blend door problem, heat from the heater core blending with the cold air, and things like that..If the suction line is cold, and you have good air flow, then start checking under the dash..But your pressures are way off for 100 degree ambient temp...

-------------------------
Chick
Email: Chick

---------------------------------------------

Freedoms just another word for nothing left to lose

atxjax on Sun June 28, 2009 10:17 AM User is offlineView users profile

OK. I will check the condensor and the put a new charge in it. At 100 degrees here in Texas my low side pressure ahould be right at 50 to 55 PSI. Hopefully everything works out. Once I do this again I will post my pressures at 1500 RPM.

atxjax on Sun June 28, 2009 11:22 AM User is offlineView users profile

Alright. 1st step was to clean the condensor. This car was in a accident before so the consensor is a bit bowed in but nothing is bent at any wierd angles. I was able to get a soft bristle brush and I used some formula 409 and scrubbed the condensor clean. It had some dirt and bugs as I rinsed it off.

One thing that I just remembered that I totally forgot to do when charging the system was to purge the can line of air. Dumb move onmy behlaf. I will make sure i do it next time.

Since I replaced the receiver / dryer do you guys recommend I put a 2oz charge of PAG46 in it? The reason why I didnt put it in the first time was because I used the Quest Artic chill and I think it already had some type of lubricant in it.

I will be going on a small road trip today ( 30 miles ) to visit some friends. I will report back on how it does. I appreciate all your help.

daman on Sun June 28, 2009 11:29 AM User is offlineView users profile

Quote
Originally posted by: atxjax
Alright. 1st step was to clean the condensor. This car was in a accident before so the consensor is a bit bowed in but nothing is bent at any wierd angles. I was able to get a soft bristle brush and I used some formula 409 and scrubbed the condensor clean. It had some dirt and bugs as I rinsed it off.



One thing that I just remembered that I totally forgot to do when charging the system was to purge the can line of air. Dumb move onmy behlaf. I will make sure i do it next time.



Since I replaced the receiver / dryer do you guys recommend I put a 2oz charge of PAG46 in it? The reason why I didnt put it in the first time was because I used the Quest Artic chill and I think it already had some type of lubricant in it.



I will be going on a small road trip today ( 30 miles ) to visit some friends. I will report back on how it does. I appreciate all your help.
yes a new R/D you should have put a few oz's of oil in,how much oil was in the can 2oz's?



-------------------------
'00 Pontiac Sunfire 2200 I4 SFI
'99 Chevy 4x4 Z-71 5.7 Vortec v8 CPFI
'97 Chevy 4x4 6.5 Turbo Diesel 2500
'95 Pontiac Grand Am GT 3100 v6 SFI
'88 Chevrolet Camaro IROC 5.7 TPI(49,000 original miles)

atxjax on Sun June 28, 2009 11:37 AM User is offlineView users profile

Dang.................

I just finished reading this stupid can. It says " Contains 16oz of R134a and 2oz of Sub-Zero sysnthetic A/C Booster with Stop Leak"

The Can itself is 18oz but only 16oz of R134a. So in all reality I only added 16oz.

The cars manual calls for 17.6 to 19.2oz of 134A.

I guess tomorrow I will recharge it and make sure I put a 2oz charge of PAG46 and put the proper amounbt of R134A in it. And yes.....purge the fill line of any air.

Sound about right?

daman on Sun June 28, 2009 11:55 AM User is offlineView users profile

Stop leak!!! oh no shame on you!! ,anyway yea make sure you put the right amount in no snake oil!,so it said booster and stop leak no oil tho?? confused on that, post back with your numbers like chick asked,make sure u do any repairs before recharging.

-------------------------
'00 Pontiac Sunfire 2200 I4 SFI
'99 Chevy 4x4 Z-71 5.7 Vortec v8 CPFI
'97 Chevy 4x4 6.5 Turbo Diesel 2500
'95 Pontiac Grand Am GT 3100 v6 SFI
'88 Chevrolet Camaro IROC 5.7 TPI(49,000 original miles)

atxjax on Sun June 28, 2009 12:41 PM User is offlineView users profile

I will work on that tonight and post back in the morning. Hopefully it will be working by then.

atxjax on Mon June 29, 2009 10:02 AM User is offlineView users profile

OK guys here are my results of my evac and recharge....

At 1500 RPM....

90 Degree ambient temp

50 PSI low side ( reading red numbers )

140 PSI High side ( reading red numbers on the gauge ) This is a mastercool gauge set.

Vent temps at 42 degrees


Its plenty cold and I ran the car up and down the highway. Vent temps remained about the same.

daman on Mon June 29, 2009 10:09 AM User is offlineView users profile

Did you put the proper factory amount back in??? if so should be looking good.

-------------------------
'00 Pontiac Sunfire 2200 I4 SFI
'99 Chevy 4x4 Z-71 5.7 Vortec v8 CPFI
'97 Chevy 4x4 6.5 Turbo Diesel 2500
'95 Pontiac Grand Am GT 3100 v6 SFI
'88 Chevrolet Camaro IROC 5.7 TPI(49,000 original miles)

atxjax on Mon June 29, 2009 10:28 AM User is offlineView users profile

Yeah, Put close to 20oz in. Factory specs call for 19.2 so it should be good. One thing I totally forgot to replace as cheap insurance was the valve cores. Im kicking myself right now for not doing that.

daman on Mon June 29, 2009 10:34 AM User is offlineView users profile

Quote
Originally posted by: daman
make sure u do any repairs before recharging.




-------------------------
'00 Pontiac Sunfire 2200 I4 SFI
'99 Chevy 4x4 Z-71 5.7 Vortec v8 CPFI
'97 Chevy 4x4 6.5 Turbo Diesel 2500
'95 Pontiac Grand Am GT 3100 v6 SFI
'88 Chevrolet Camaro IROC 5.7 TPI(49,000 original miles)

atxjax on Mon June 29, 2009 5:05 PM User is offlineView users profile

Well, looks like something isnt right again. My girlf is driving the car while Im at work. She said the a/c is taking forever to cool down. Im thinking that maybe the valve cores are leaking. I told her to pull the low side cap off and she said she saw some bubbles in the valve. Makes sense to me. When I install the gauges it holds 29HG of vaccum overnight so I know the only thing that it can be is those valve cores.


I will replace those and vaccum it down again. Sucks to have to do this all over again if I wasnt a cheapskate and do everything right from the beginning.

Edited: Mon June 29, 2009 at 6:03 PM by atxjax

mk378 on Mon June 29, 2009 10:54 PM User is offline

Probably more than just the valve cores. Even though shrader valves sometimes leak, the caps should be keeping the charge in. I'd wonder about that slightly bent condenser. Also leaks in "soft" parts, like o-rings or the compressor seal, can hold vacuum but leak under pressure.

Edited: Mon June 29, 2009 at 10:55 PM by mk378

atxjax on Mon June 29, 2009 11:09 PM User is offlineView users profile

Gotcha. I was able to pull the schrader cores out. When I took the caps off I heard a " Pffft " noise so they were definately leaking.

I bought a can of 134 with dye in it this time. Also a co-worker of mine has a 134 sniffer so if it leaks again I will use that to find it.

atxjax on Tue June 30, 2009 10:26 AM User is offlineView users profile

OK. Quick summary of what I've done.

I replaced the service valve cores last night. I pulled a vaccumm for about 2 hours. got it down to 29-30HG and left it overnight.

It held this morning when I woke up. I pulled another vaccumm for about 30 mins.

I added a 2oz charge of PAG46

Then I added 12oz of 134 with UV leak detector

Then I added another half can of just 134A

Ambient temp was about 80.

Low side pressure 40 High side 130 at 1500 RPM.

Vent temps at 42-44 degrees


After servicing I chjecked the service valves. Cleaned them up and just hose it off with a bit of water. I was able to see a bubble about every two seconds coming out of the low side port. I blew out the water and adjusted it out a bit. I kept checking and I got it to the point where I didnt see any more airbubbles when the port had a bit of water in it. Hopefully that was my leak.

I put the service caps back on and took it for a drive to Autozone to go return the loaner tools. Vent temps right at 42 degrees. Came back home and removed the service port caps........I did not hear that " Pffffffft" sound so Im hoping its sealed for good.

Will repor tback if It goes low again or I find a leak now that I have a blacklight and its got UV leak detector in it.


Thanks alot guys.

atxjax on Wed July 01, 2009 2:10 PM User is offlineView users profile

I got everything fixed and found the leak. I replaced the low side service valave but it still leaks out. I confirme dby filling the serice valve with water and watching bubbles come up. I adjusted it to where it almost stopped but I still have like 1 very tiny bubble about every 4 to 5 minutes. Should it be OK with the cover cap justscrewed it very tight?

daman on Wed July 01, 2009 2:37 PM User is offlineView users profile

Yes put a nice new cap with seal on it and will hold that little bit,actually that's the main purpose of the caps,the last line of defense against leaks!!!

-------------------------
'00 Pontiac Sunfire 2200 I4 SFI
'99 Chevy 4x4 Z-71 5.7 Vortec v8 CPFI
'97 Chevy 4x4 6.5 Turbo Diesel 2500
'95 Pontiac Grand Am GT 3100 v6 SFI
'88 Chevrolet Camaro IROC 5.7 TPI(49,000 original miles)

atxjax on Wed July 01, 2009 2:58 PM User is offlineView users profile

OK. Thanks. I cant find some damn caps that will fit . I looked for them here also.

Edited: Wed July 01, 2009 at 3:15 PM by atxjax

daman on Wed July 01, 2009 7:23 PM User is offlineView users profile

have a ac shop near by?

-------------------------
'00 Pontiac Sunfire 2200 I4 SFI
'99 Chevy 4x4 Z-71 5.7 Vortec v8 CPFI
'97 Chevy 4x4 6.5 Turbo Diesel 2500
'95 Pontiac Grand Am GT 3100 v6 SFI
'88 Chevrolet Camaro IROC 5.7 TPI(49,000 original miles)

atxjax on Thu July 02, 2009 10:23 AM User is offlineView users profile

I will check around. So far so good. We are getitng 100 degree days here and its workingout pretty good. I will try to find some new caps. So far I havent gotten any more pressure buildup under the cap I checke dit yesterday and the tell tale " pffft" noise was gone.

atxjax on Thu July 02, 2009 6:33 PM User is offlineView users profile

Looks like I keep losing my charge. I checked the lowside service valave again and it still leaks very very slowly. I noticed a difference in the air in the past 2 days. I might just have to by some OEM seals and see if I can install those.


I noticed somehting wierd about my charge as well as shown by the gauge here. It was 104 degrees today.

At Idle I get this...........Almost 70PSI




At 1500 RPM I get this.....45PSI




Any idea what could be going on here besides the cheap gauge? Need to get this fixed. I appreciate all your help.

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