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Flushing same as Evacuating?

Help_Me on Fri May 22, 2009 1:07 PM User is offline

Year: 1993
Make: Pontiac
Model: Grand Am
Engine Size: 3.3
Country of Origin: United States

Hello, My V5 Compressor Seized on my 1993 Pontiac Grand Am. I am going to replace it and wanted to convert to R134a. I will also change the Drier. I called a shop to get a quote on flushing the system and adding the R134 and they said flushing is the same as evacuating. But I have read online that when a compressor seizes they system should get flushed first. Is the shop wrong? Also I will add a couple ounces of pag150 oil to the new compressor. How much oil should the shop add after the flush and/or evacuating is complete? Thanks you for your help!

HECAT on Fri May 22, 2009 2:04 PM User is offline

Yes the shop was wrong.

Flushing is using a liquid solvent and delivery method to wash out all the waste oils, debris, and other foreign substances.

Evacuation is pulling a vacuum on the system to remove air and moisture (humidity).

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FLUSHING TECHNICAL PAPER vs2.pdf 

TRB on Fri May 22, 2009 5:53 PM User is offlineView users profile

Quote
Originally posted by: HECAT
Yes the shop was wrong.



Flushing is using a liquid solvent and delivery method to wash out all the waste oils, debris, and other foreign substances.



Evacuation is pulling a vacuum on the system to remove air and moisture (humidity).

I am truly amazed at now many times I am asked this question after a customer has spoken to another shop.



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Dougflas on Fri May 22, 2009 10:52 PM User is offline

If you use r134, you'll probably need to change the control valve in the compressor.

NickD on Sat May 23, 2009 5:36 AM User is offline

A seized compressor is catastrophic failure normally loading up the rest of the system with debris, any debris left in the system will lead to an early disaster with a new compressor. Almost sounds like you purchased your own compressor and looking for a shop to install it for you, in such a case, that shop will not warranty it. Plus it sounds like you picked a shop that doesn't even know the very basics. Have four shops like that in town, just do not comprehend how they are still in business, one good reason to do it myself. They do know how to charge however, and I am not talking about charging with refrigerant. And love to erroneous quote the EPA.

Cussboy on Sat May 23, 2009 11:10 AM User is offline

Quote
Originally posted by: Help_Me
shop said flushing is the same as evacuating.

I would run, not walk, far away from them !!!

TRB on Sat May 23, 2009 12:07 PM User is offlineView users profile

Quote
Originally posted by: Cussboy
Quote
Originally posted by: Help_Me
shop said flushing is the same as evacuating.

I would run, not walk, far away from them !!!

Cussboy you would be surprised at how many "professional" shops do not know or have the equipment to remove the debris we find in damaged systems. I'm amazed at times how these types of shops just blame the compressor and want a warranty.

-------------------------
When considering your next auto A/C purchase, please consider the site that supports you: ACkits.com
Contact: ACKits.com

Cussboy on Sat May 23, 2009 3:08 PM User is offline

Quote
Originally posted by: TRB
Cussboy you would be surprised at how many "professional" shops do not know or have the equipment to remove the debris we find in damaged systems. I'm amazed at times how these types of shops just blame the compressor and want a warranty.

I remember when I backflushed my condenser and high pressure line on my '88 Mazda B2200 truck after a compressor seize, there was definitely debris in the solvent.

As to "professional" shops, not AC-related, but in 1980s an import repair shop told my sister (she took it there to have all the fluids changed) that her just-purchased used Datsun truck needed a new clutch because there was only 1 inch pedal free play (also indicative of a new clutch disc), where previous owner (who worked at a dealership) had replaced it two months earlier. They said the clutch slave cylinder was also leaking, but they were afraid to touch it because of the clutch condition. She told them not to touch anything, and I took off the slave cylinder without any repair manual, found the leak to be from the clutch master cylinder, replaced that, and she NEVER had a lick of trouble from it. Some professional shop, tried to ream a girl.

Jump to 1996, wife took our recently-purchased '88 Sub in for a transmission fluid change, since I'd only worked on manual transmissions. They called me to come take a look, showed me a small amount of particles in the pan, I said that didn't look too bad for 2 years since last change, then they showed me BLACK transmission fluid and said they were afraid to add new fluid as it would lock up the transmission, said it needed rebuild or they could add-back the dirty fluid. I said add back the dirty fluid. That evening, checked the transmission fluid and it was PINK !!! So obviously the balck fluid couldn't have been from my Sub. And this from a transmission shop, not even an all-purpose shop. They offered a $150 teardown/inspection on my transmission, and if it didn't measure to spec, that $150 could be applied to a rebuild (if not, apparently such transmission would be in boxes). I think they also tried to scare a woman customer, so I'd say from experience that it happens on purpose, not just from ignorance.

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