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American Beef Problem Pages: 12

Anonymous on Sat December 27, 2003 1:40 PM User is offline

I bet if they lowered the price a little the whole US population might start buying more of it and would probably off set the loss, Have you priced just hamburger meat lately? not to mention a steak i would have to re-finance my home to eat steak for a week!

U.S. Loses Nearly 90 Percent of Beef Exports
Mad Cow Scare Drives Away Over a Dozen Countries
By EMILY GERSEMA, AP

WASHINGTON (Dec. 27) - Just days after discovering the nation's first case of mad cow disease, the United States has lost nearly all of its beef exports as more than a dozen countries stopped buying American beef as insurance against potential infection.

MrBillPro on Sat December 27, 2003 1:41 PM User is offlineView users profile

That was my post above! I hate it when that happens. But that Anonymous picture better resembles the way i look after making it though the Christmas Holiday he! he!


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Don't take life seriously... Its not permanent.

Edited: Sat December 27, 2003 at 1:49 PM by MrBillPro

k5guy on Sat December 27, 2003 2:54 PM User is offline

Even though the US Government says the beef supply is safe, it is really? What guarantees do we have from them if they are proved to be wrong? What chance do you have of winning a lawsuit like that when you are dead?



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TRB on Sat December 27, 2003 3:08 PM User is offlineView users profile

Oh no not another conspiracy!!!!! What information did you have before that confirmed the meat was safe??? Love to see how BigChris and you spin this into a Microsoft issue, HEHEHEHE!

Supply and demand, Rib Eye should be pretty cheap in a month or so!!!!!!! Correct me if I’m wrong but you can only get MCD if you eat a product that contains the brains or the spine. Where are these products used in the daily food chain? Last Rib Eye I had it did not have any brains or spine products that I noticed.


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TXAB on Sat December 27, 2003 3:28 PM User is offline

MrBillPro,

You live in the Houston area, right? Shop at HEB. T-bones and Ribeyes are on sale often for 3.99 or less, per pound. That's pretty cheap. As for ground meat, try looking at Sam's club. I'm buying 10% fat ground beef for $1.66 per pound. I buy when on sale and store in my freezer. I can have a juicy steak whenever I want. If you like pork, try buying a whole boneless pork loin and slice it yourself into what ever thickness chops you like. Great on the grill!!!! That' usually $1.99 per pound or less.

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"Don't get stuck on stupid!"
---- Lt. Gen. Russel Honore

k5guy on Sat December 27, 2003 4:23 PM User is offline

Quote
Originally posted by: TRB
Oh no not another conspiracy!!!!! What information did you have before that confirmed the meat was safe??? Love to see how BigChris and you spin this into a Microsoft issue, HEHEHEHE!

Hey, maybe Microsoft planned this to create a diversion from thier planned Total World Domination (TWD)!

Oh, back to the beef. Let's see, the FDA puts this sticker on it that says Grade A inspected. If the US Government wasn't assuring people that it was safe, people wouldn't buy it.

Quote
Supply and demand, Rib Eye should be pretty cheap in a month or so!!!!!!! Correct me if I’m wrong but you can only get MCD if you eat a product that contains the brains or the spine. Where are these products used in the daily food chain? Last Rib Eye I had it did not have any brains or spine products that I noticed.

My point is that if you are wrong, you have contracted a fatal disease, for which there is no known cure. Since I have no experience with bovine spongiform encephalopathy (BSE) aka MCD, or most zoonosis (zoonosis is a disease that humans may acquire from animals), I don't have any direct knowledge of this disease. Do you?

Then it becomes a question of trust. Who do you trust? What options do you have if the experts are wrong?

Otherwise, here is the cost/benefit ratio:
eat beef- low cost for beef, possibility of getting a non-reversable fatal illness.
don't eat beef- higher cost for other food products, lowered possibility of getting a non-reversable fatal illness.



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MrBillPro on Sat December 27, 2003 4:50 PM User is offlineView users profile

TXAB, Thanks for the info I do shop Sam's mostly on West Rd. by the house, but Momma has borrowed me from there since i came home with a new leather couch and love seat $$$$$ of course she still has not sat with me in the love seat he! he!. It's only money I have never seen a hearst pulling a uhaul so you can't take it with you but you can leave it for your kids to fight over. I will have to keep the HEB flyers when they come and check them out.


k5guy, I hope you can't get anything from sheep, I knew i should not have taken FFA in school.


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Don't take life seriously... Its not permanent.

Edited: Sat December 27, 2003 at 4:56 PM by MrBillPro

TRB on Sat December 27, 2003 5:13 PM User is offlineView users profile

K5, if the meat is safe with a FDA stamp why did they pull product? Again I ask the products brain and spine are used in what food we eat? I heard different stories that the meat is safe. Then they pull product that was associated with the cow. Another thing I heard was a Steer is where our beef supply (Steak) comes from not a dairy cow. I think I would be more worried about a glass of milk! Not a farmer by any means but watching stories about Food lion and others seems to point out we get a hell of a lot of disease in our food every day! I'm by no means making light of MCD but find we the public are last to know about this kind of stuff, FDA stamp or not!!! Know that I have my weekend projects finished think I'll do a little research on this for piece of mind.

Back to eating penguin again I guess!!!!!

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Bigchris on Sat December 27, 2003 6:01 PM User is offline

The foods where brain and spine parts are found are pizza dressings, hamburgers and hot dogs. So called "muscle meats" and steaks are unlikely to carry the disease but anything ground is suspect because the same grinders alternately grind head and neck parts and then loins and steaks.

MrBP, sheep get a disease called scrapie. The outbreak in europe was believed to be caused by sheep with this disease being ground up in cattle feed.

The FDA has now admitted that it has no testing plan in place to keep mad cow from reaching the public. Since the disease has a gestation period of 4 to 4.5 years, there is no telling how many other animals have been infected.

The worst news is that you don't get it from eating potato chips and cherry coke.

TRB on Sat December 27, 2003 6:28 PM User is offlineView users profile

Heck I was going to order a pizza tonight! Guess I still can, one dough and sauce to go please!!!!

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Dougflas on Sat December 27, 2003 7:12 PM User is offline

Man, if beer gets contaminated, we'll all be in deep do do.

Bigchris on Sat December 27, 2003 7:53 PM User is offline

I'd have thought pepperoni would be okay but maybe not...
http://www.ag.auburn.edu/~ckerth/470/classnotes/recipes/Pepperoni.PDF

k5guy on Sun December 28, 2003 2:33 AM User is offline

I guess that turkey hot dogs are ok. I'd like to see some more evidence on BSE. I'm in contact with an expert (MD) from Boston U. Maybe I'll get something out of him.


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Karl Hofmann on Sun December 28, 2003 5:48 AM User is offlineView users profile

BSE is indeed derived from the desease that sheep have suffered from for hundreds of years known as scrapie. The desease was passed on to cattle because the fodder manufacturers decided to save a few quid by heat treating the protiein element at a lower temperature. This protein element consisted of the parts of the carcase that even the food processers were not allowed to put in to our food, brains.

The only part of the cow that is not used is the Moo, all the rest is used by the food manufacturers to feed us. The safest part of the animal is the prime flesh, though I understand that if there is a bone in it then the membrane round the bone does carry a greater risk, that is why during our problems meat on the bone was banned. The highest risk is indeed the spinal cord and the brain, both of which can find their way in to food made from "mechanically recovered meat" ie meat that is quite literally removed from the bone using a pressure washer. this meat is then used to make burgers, franks, sausages, and other convienience foods. In short this sort of food is indeed made from lips and asses (and anything that they can find inbetween).

We also were told that Beef was safe, I will never forget the image of the minister John Gummer shoving a burger in to his daughters mouth. If your Government admits to one case of BSE then that would be a fair bet that it is already out of control and a wide spread problem.

The British Beef industry is still fighting to recover their market share and exports to France and Germany have only just recently started but strict measures (To the point of being draconian) have ensured that British Beef is now the safest in the world.

By the way, beef hides are used to make gelatin and this product is regularly used as a clearing agent in beer.

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Never knock on deaths door... Ring the doorbell and run away, death really hates that!

Bigchris on Sun December 28, 2003 12:16 PM User is offline

Well Karl thanks for a really informative post! If this country runs true to form half the population will be in denial and the other half will panic. But at least the half that panics will get some relief from our growing obesity epidemic. The Democrats will blame GWB for poor leadership while still claiming that the situation is under control. I see our government is already pointing a finger at Canada, but not willing to speculate on how many thousands of other cows might have followed that "one stray" across the border. CNN regularly shows video of your minister feeding his daughter but I suspect that most dismiss it as "that british fool" without seeing the parallel to our own FDA's performance.

I've also heard rumors of a similar disease in pigs but can't point to any published discussion of it. Some of our midwestern states have been struggling with a similar disease in deer and elk as well and that has gotten some limited press attention.

Well here we go again, lots of chicken and turkey, the horses won't be safe and maybe our aussie friends will finally convince us that 'roo is a good thing.

TRB on Sun December 28, 2003 12:44 PM User is offlineView users profile

Hillary must be buying Tyson stock again, darn conspiracy!!!!!

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Karl Hofmann on Sun December 28, 2003 1:20 PM User is offlineView users profile

For a long time now I have avoided processed meat of any kind, beef, pork, venison, lamb etc because what ever they did with beef they will be doing with every other animal too. The only time that I will ever touch burgers is when I can see what goes into them, fortunately our local butcher invites his customers to pick the meat that they want and then makes the burgers on the spot.

For quite a while the British were in denial and then panicked over the BSE crisis over false information, conflicting information and a general state of cluelessness from the government. The crisis was eventually brought under control with the mass destruction of all cattle over a certain age and radical changes to the feed regime. In some areas wild game were also being destroyed

What I found particularly gauling (No pun intended) was the attitude of the French towards our Beef when they themselves had covered over the fact that their BSE problem was much worse. They wouldn't even permit us to transport our beef in sealed reefers to Spain (Who after the initial ban did start importing again) On my trips through France I would regularly see (And smell) high sided bulk tippers loaded with carcases on their way to be disposed of as the French tried to sort themselves out on the quiet.

Ultimately, I guess those of us who buy food on price rather than quality should take part of the blame as there will always be someone who can make food cheaper, the question is what do they put in it to make it cheap?

I managed to see a little TV this week as I snoozed off my Christmas pudding and caught part of a series called Clarkson meets the neighbours. Jeremy Clarkson is one of our highest profile motoring journalists and the series follows him travelling round Europe taking a cockeyed look at our european neighbours. What had particularly interested me was an interview with the Italian Slow food society who existed to stem the tide of fast food outlets, their viev was that we would be better off taking time to eat quality (Traditional)food slowly, and although it would be better quality it would work out cheaper because we would eat less of it. I think that this may hold some merit.



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Never knock on deaths door... Ring the doorbell and run away, death really hates that!

Edited: Sun December 28, 2003 at 1:35 PM by Karl Hofmann

Bigchris on Sun December 28, 2003 1:32 PM User is offline

Oh! Sorry Tim, I didn't mean to exclude Penguins!

Maybe it's time to admit that your business is really just a front for the world's largest Penguin farm and you're ready to meet the nation's meat needs.

Bigchris on Sun December 28, 2003 1:45 PM User is offline

Quote
Originally posted by: Karl Hofmann
What had particularly interested me was an interview with the Italian Slow food society who existed to stem the tide of fast food outlets, their viev was that we would be better off taking time to eat quality (Traditional)food slowly, and although it would be better quality it would work out cheaper because we would eat less of it. I think that this may hold some merit.
That strikes a responsive chord Karl, but for an odd reason. For years we kept large breed dogs, Irish Wolfhounds and Great Danes, and always fed them the best quality, balanced nutrition food we could buy. We did that because it was good for them and because they only needed half the quantity compared to cheaper brands.

So how come we're not smart enough to do the same thing for ourselves?

Karl Hofmann on Sun December 28, 2003 1:58 PM User is offlineView users profile

LOL I guess because we love our dogs but expect someone else to look after our health. Our pet food industry was more tightly regulated than food for human consumption.

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Never knock on deaths door... Ring the doorbell and run away, death really hates that!

k5guy on Sun December 28, 2003 2:54 PM User is offline

For those interested, the MD at Boston U suggested this link at the CDC for information on BSE. He suggested a couple of other links, but these track the progress of the disease around the globe. Those aren't relevant to this discussion at this point.

I'm glad our friends in the UK can assist us with assessing our level of risk. Karl, what about turkey and chicken? What is the story there?


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Karl Hofmann on Sun December 28, 2003 8:32 PM User is offlineView users profile

K5, Enjoy as much chicken, turkey pork and lamb as you like, they are all safe, but our problems taught me to use my common sense and eat proper cuts of meat rather than re formed meat style mush, at least you can see what you are getting. Throughout the BSE crisis I did continue to eat beef cuts, but made sure that it was well cooked, no red. The chances of contracting VCJD are very small and I would say dont panic, as long as your authorities are taking steps to erradicate the problem.

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Never knock on deaths door... Ring the doorbell and run away, death really hates that!

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